Shimano Saragosa

[DaFrogman]

Ahoy all ye Tackle Fiends.... Boy its been quiet around here and I've been pretty quiet myself... Yesterday, I dropped by Capt Fred's to grab a spool of braid for my recently rebuilt Kaikon and Lo and Behold, there was the new big Stella and the 2 largest sized Shimano Saragosa spinning reels.

I gotta tell ya, the Saragosa looks and feels like a winner. I have no idea how they will actually fish, but the reel is VERY smooth and the build looks very solid especially the 14,000 and 18,000 sizes which have all aluminium bodies, spools and rotors. Prices seem to be very competitive too, under $500.... I think the Twinpowers will be in trouble if these reels prove reliable.

Overall, the reel seems to be an upgraded Spheros and Thunnus, with higher gear ratios, decent drags and a decent handle. Reports from some of the OZ forums seem positive.... I may actually get one or two to replace my aging fleet of Penn SS reels for the Surf and Rock stuff and maybe medium jig.... Here are a few pics and specs from some Shimano sites around the net...

# Paladin Gear Durability Enhancement
# Propulsion Line Management System
# S A-RB Shielded Ball Bearings
# High Speed Retrieves
# Stopperless Design (No Anti-Reverse Switch)
# Aluminum Frame
# Graphite Rotor (Aluminum on14000 & 18000 sizes)
# Power Roller III Line Roller
# S-Arm Cam # One-Piece Bail Wire
# Aerowave Oscillation (3000-8000 sizes only)
# Aero Wrap Oscillation (14000 & 18000 sizes only)
# Super Stopper II Anti-Reverse
# 5+1 Bearings (6+1 on 14000 & 18000 sizes)
# Direct Drive Mechanism
# Machined Aluminum Handle Shank
# Dyna-Balance # Fluidrive II
# Cold Forged Aluminum Spool
# Drilled Spool Skirt
# Titanium Spool Lip
# Waterproof Drag
# Easy Access Drag Washers
# Dartainium Drag (6000-18000 sizes only)
# Ergonomic Handle Grips # Septon Handle Grips
# Repairable Clicker

I think Shimano may have nailed this one just right... Try 'em for yourself..

Regards,

Saimee

[geraldng]

Hope to see feedback on this reel ASAP.....

[eeyore]

hi saimee .....just would like to know whether the max drag of 44lbs for model SRG14000F is true ? because according to the shimano catelog the idel drag is rated as only 9kg or 20lbs that is a lot of different ?? Thank you.

[Akudou]

eeyore, think the drag is 18kg on the 18k model

[du1]

Hi saimee,

I look at the reel allready, quite interesting,
I think of getting the 8000 ,

Not too expensive for limied budget.


Cheers

[DaFrogman]

Eeyore dude,

I will see if the shop will let me scale the drags out, but the reels are rated at a max of 44lbs of drag on the US Shimano site.

I imagine that the 14000 might actually make a teensy bit more drag than the 18000 because the drag washer space in the spool is a bit larger on teh 14000 spool (whilst having less line capacity than the 18000).


Du1,

I did play with the 8000 sized one in the Sengkurong shop and my 1st thoughts were that it felt a lot more solid than my Twinpower 8000PG, but on the other hand it also felt a bit heavier....

I reckon it is good value for a decent spinning reel on the budget. In the past (i.e. waaayyyy in the past), the all metal Penn SS would have cost similar money for the 8500 sized reels.

Will see if I have time to play some more.

regards,

Saimee

[Shel]

I am also interested in the 8000, feels just nice so i can probably tell more when I get my hands on one. Feels very solid but heavy. The Palladin gear feels a lot different than reels without.

However, what's the differences of 'dartanium'? is this another variant of the famed carnbontex?

[du1]

Saimee,

I agree with you on that, way2 back years ago, penn 9500 are more expensive than that, i am waiting for comments from people who use it allready, i kind of like it for bottom bashing on shallow waters, but for deep waters i still prefer & trust my jigger 5k & 5kp.

Soon people will get he hand on it,,

There should be few comments on that.



Regards.


Du1

[DaFrogman]

Shel,

The Dartanium drags are the Shimano pure carbon drags like those you find as original in the Trinidads, Toriums etc etc.

Carbontex drags are aftermarket Carbonfibre drags which I very much prefer. There are no specific carbontex drag sets for the Saragosa yet, but if I can get the sizing for the stock drags, I am pretty sure that there I will have something that fits after some mix and match...

Du1,

I just don't use spinning reels for bottom fishing any more... Last time was around 15 years ago. I prefer to rely on my overhead reels Trini, OJ and Kaikon. Spin reels are strictly beach, jig, pop, lure affairs.

Will maybe drop by CFFS tomorrow to do the drag test...

Saimee

[Shel]

Ok...So I've got the Saragosa 8000F off the shelf, filled it with 50lbs Powerpro and paired with a Lemax 8' PE3-6 popping rod for my recent BSR Mekong cat fight.

The reel performed marvelously under stress and I'd hazzard a guess that it might be different than with a GT or YellowFin Tuna at the end of the line. It comes as stated in the specs and the drag is smooth.

I put it under pressure by continuing to take hook ups from the cats and each fight lasting an average 15-20 min with the drag adjusted to about 5-7kg. The spool heated up but the drag did not fail or cooked up, staying creamy smooth.

Whilst it is designed to be a an affordable 'tank', I noticed after my fishing day that the handle seemed to have a 'slight' wobble, doesn't seemed as tight as before. Its a screw in handle and has the touted 'Paladin Gear' stuff.

Is this normal or should i be worried?

[DaFrogman]

Originally Posted by Shel

Whilst it is designed to be a an affordable 'tank', I noticed after my fishing day that the handle seemed to have a 'slight' wobble, doesn't seemed as tight as before. Its a screw in handle and has the touted 'Paladin Gear' stuff.

Is this normal or should i be worried?

Dude,

Is the wobble at the handle knob or does it seem to come from the internal gearing.

I reckon that it would be normal to have a new reel "run in" a little after a 1st time good session. As long as the gears run smoothly and quietly, I reckon you should be ok. If the gears are smooth BUT the handle wobble begins to affect the balance of reel, then bring it back to Shimano ASAP.

I note that ksong (a well known US jigger) has posted on a number of US forums regarding a problem he had with a big Saragosa. However, it is worth noting that the problems seemed to be drag related after he hooked up to a BIG bluefin tuna that blazed off a 250-300 yard run under over 20lbs of drag!!!. That was after he had boated a number of BFT already some over 100lbs in weight.

Hmmmmmm.... I see greased carbontex drags in the future

Regards,

Saimee

[Shel]

Hey Saimee,

That's what I thought so too, abt it being 'run-in' as I kept rechecking. The wobble is not from the handle but from the internal gearing.

I noticed the wobble after the 15th cat (the biggest one at 39kg) that took off with my line. However, I noted that subsequent fights were alright still. Just that since this is new so I thought I'd asked.

Another point to note is that eventhough the drag stated on the OZ & US webbies as 12Kg and 27lbs respectively, the harcopy asia dealer's catalogue only states 7Kg so I'd reckond that the 7kg might be the min instead so it needs some verification here.

The Saragosa 6000-8000F is also almost identical with the new '08 Stradic 6000-8000FI except that the Stradic has slightly faster speed & bigger line capacity and an extra spool but I wonder how'd would the two compare. Any inkling?

Anyway the bigger 14-18000 ones with lower 4:9:1 speeds, can they be used for popping or are they generally more for jigging?

Can my current 8000F/ 8' PE3-6 set up be used in the Maldives and Christmas Islands? I might get an additional Twinpower/Carpenter set up but I thought if it could still come in handy...



Cheers

[DaFrogman]

Originally Posted by Shel

That's what I thought so too, abt it being 'run-in' as I kept rechecking. The wobble is not from the handle but from the internal gearing.

The Saragosa 6000-8000F is also almost identical with the new '08 Stradic 6000-8000FI except that the Stradic has slightly faster speed & bigger line capacity and an extra spool but I wonder how'd would the two compare. Any inkling?

Anyway the bigger 14-18000 ones with lower 4:9:1 speeds, can they be used for popping or are they generally more for jigging?

Can my current 8000F/ 8' PE3-6 set up be used in the Maldives and Christmas Islands? I might get an additional Twinpower/Carpenter set up but I thought if it could still come in handy...

You should have a look at the line retrieval rates to figure out if the reel is fast enough. But if you follow the differences in the old Stella (01 models) there seems to be a definite preference for the SW10000 with the faster gear ratio for popping.... I have no idea what speed you would need for big swimbaits.

I haven't played with a Stradic, so can't really help you there matey.

As for the wobble, if you are planning on taking the reel on an expensive long range trip, get it checked by Shimano first. Its not worth bringing a reel you feel unsure of on a big trip. As for the applicability to the Maldives & Christmas islands, I can't speak from experience.... i.e. never been there. BUT the reports over the years seem to indicate big GTs and Doggies, so it might be worthwhile tracking down an old model Stella or getting a new model.

Oh and before I start sounding like a Shimano rep.... let it be known that my big spinning reel is a Saltiga 6500EXP...

Regards,

Saimee

[eeyore]

Originally Posted by Shel

The Saragosa 6000-8000F is also almost identical with the new '08 Stradic 6000-8000FI except that the Stradic has slightly faster speed & bigger line capacity and an extra spool but I wonder how'd would the two compare. Any inkling?

Anyway the bigger 14-18000 ones with lower 4:9:1 speeds, can they be used for popping or are they generally more for jigging?

Can my current 8000F/ 8' PE3-6 set up be used in the Maldives and Christmas Islands? I might get an additional Twinpower/Carpenter set up but I thought if it could still come in handy...

Cheers

Yes some how you are right the Stradic is rather similar than Saragosa and understand the Stradic is quite popular in malaysia after all the Stradic is made in malaysia.

Your current popping setup 8000F/ 8' PE3-6 is good for maldives & xmas island trip but it is slightly on the light to medium side as for these two places big chugger still the most effective popper for GT which you need harder rod to work on the big chugger for big splashes & sounds.

Happy Fishing

[Shel]

Originally Posted by eeyore

Yes some how you are right the Stradic is rather similar than Saragosa and understand the Stradic is quite popular in malaysia after all the Stradic is made in malaysia.

Your current popping setup 8000F/ 8' PE3-6 is good for maldives & xmas island trip but it is slightly on the light to medium side as for these two places big chugger still the most effective popper for GT which you need harder rod to work on the big chugger for big splashes & sounds.

Happy Fishing

For a while there I was contemplating getting the Stradic but hell, i might just get one to play with. Any idea on the feel of the new Stradic? At the least I can use it for sails in Rompin.

Looks like I would need to burn another hole for some newer gear then. What's your recommendation of a decent setup for these 2 places? Is it in the realm of >PE8-10?
Would a Twinpower 8000HG with Shimano Kaibutsu S8208 Long Cast PE 6-8 do?

P.s: I am no affiliate but I like Shimano's stuff....

[eeyore]

Originally Posted by Shel

For a while there I was contemplating getting the Stradic but hell, i might just get one to play with. Any idea on the feel of the new Stradic? At the least I can use it for sails in Rompin.

Looks like I would need to burn another hole for some newer gear then. What's your recommendation of a decent setup for these 2 places? Is it in the realm of >PE8-10?
Would a Twinpower 8000HG with Shimano Kaibutsu S8208 Long Cast PE 6-8 do?

never owned both stradic & saragosa before but did feel both of them in the local tackle shop what i can say both reels look robust & smooth - JUST MY OPINION only.

happened to see one stradic reel 8000 model stripped down for normal servicing by the tackle shop boss and surprised to see the main gear is "dark" gold material made which is rather similar like stella main gear materail. Well I may be wrong anyway just an observation.

Twinpower 8000HG with Shimano Kaibutsu S8208 Long Cast PE 6-8 is a very good combo for both maldives & xmas island also a good combo for working on the stickbait.

[stickbom!]

I've fished the stradic 4000fi for a while now and its still going strong. You might be interested to know that I've been pretty slack about cleaning reels for the past year so my poor stradic only gets a rinse over with warm water after every use. I've not lubricated ANY moving part on the stradic since the day I bought it and its amazing nothing has corroded yet (keeping my fingers crossed)

As for the twinpower/kaibutsu set up... if you already have the Tanjung Pinang then just fish with it... otherwise just get the 07 or 08 biomaster pg. These reels are cheaper and has improved gearing in them. Also, the 07 Biomaster has 3 carbon drag washers in it whereas the TP only has 2! Just change the solid carbon washers to Ctex and you'll have a pretty decent offshore reel. Oh by the way, I wouldn't fish PE8 on an 8000 size reel. Max would be PE6 due to the line capacity.

[Shel]

Originally Posted by stickbom!

I've fished the stradic 4000fi for a while now and its still going strong. You might be interested to know that I've been pretty slack about cleaning reels for the past year so my poor stradic only gets a rinse over with warm water after every use. I've not lubricated ANY moving part on the stradic since the day I bought it and its amazing nothing has corroded yet (keeping my fingers crossed)

As for the twinpower/kaibutsu set up... if you already have the Tanjung Pinang then just fish with it... otherwise just get the 07 or 08 biomaster pg. These reels are cheaper and has improved gearing in them. Also, the 07 Biomaster has 3 carbon drag washers in it whereas the Tanjung Pinang only has 2! Just change the solid carbon washers to Ctex and you'll have a pretty decent offshore reel. Oh by the way, I wouldn't fish PE8 on an 8000 size reel. Max would be PE6 due to the line capacity.

Hah... was kinda waiting for you to chimed in. Actually, considering the updated versions the '08 Biomaster seemed to be even better.

I was thinking of getting the Stradic 4000FI too for those mini popping/spinning scenarios but I'd just want to see the feedback as it is kinda ..... to have 2 models of reels so close in specs.

I am not necessarily looking out on the cheap here but was just thinking what would be necessary instead of the bling. Have just been adviced that the Kaibutsu LC would be inbalanced with an 8000 reel and the fishies over at Xmas are big bullies and I need to throw in the 10000FA into the equation. The 10000FA seems to be a rather favourite model for popping.

Oh yea, any idea if which place can I take a look at HOTS Gipang in Singapore?

[Giant-Todak]

I think AO stocks Hots rods.

Shel,

U can try the 8000HG combo with a Zenaq Foketo 83-7.

[stickbom!]

I'm not 100% sure how many pieces of carbon drag washers the latest Biomaster 8000 has in them thats why I only mentioned about the 07 ones having 03 carbon drag washers Yup I'm a firm believer in using whatever it takes to get the job done and it doesn't have to be real fancy.

You can consider pairing the Kaibutsu Pencil Instrument to an 8000 sized Shimano or 4500 Daiwa. I've tried this combo and it feels pretty good. Alternatively you can try the Gipang Tide Lez series at Anglers Outfitters.

Have fun hunting for your popping outfit buddy!